Deer Forums/Houndmen Beware

nccatfisher

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
Another issue with split buck limits is poaching.

It was brought up folks have been busted shooting more than 2 bucks in the 2 buck limit area and tagging them like they shot them in the 4 buck area.

How many folks are doing that? I don't know.
Your grasping for straws now. They use the I killed them out of state and all other excuses to poach also.
 

CRC

Old Mossy Horns
I'm not grasping at straws.

I was told that by an NCWRC employee at the deer forum I went to.

Maybe the current batch of wildife enforcement officers would like to have a single buck limit to enforce? I don't know.

I don't know how much enforcement plays in enacting or rejecting regulation changes.
 
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DRS

Old Mossy Horns
I get that hunting land has gotten more exspensieve but so has owning land and living not to mention liability concerns. Timber companies are in the business of making money and if they can make more per acre leasing to an outfitter who will likely do less damage to roads/gates etc there is no reason for them not to lease to the high bidder. The cost of living has gone up in every facet of life and sadly that includes hunting.

Cost have went up and yes it is the landowners option to ask a set price or to take the highest bid for their land. All I am saying is support NC hunters first and stop the catering to out of state hunters. One club I hunted with in Halifax county was looking at leasing a 300 acre tract that and outfitter was giving up a lease. The land owner wanted what the outfitter had been paying $18/acre, by the way this was over a decade ago. Well, there was a reason the outfitter let it go, we decided the land was not worth the price. Somebody may have leased it for that, but it is just one example of how the prices can be driven up.
 

nchunt101

Ten Pointer
Cost have went up and yes it is the landowners option to ask a set price or to take the highest bid for their land. All I am saying is support NC hunters first and stop the catering to out of state hunters. One club I hunted with in Halifax county was looking at leasing a 300 acre tract that and outfitter was giving up a lease. The land owner wanted what the outfitter had been paying $18/acre, by the way this was over a decade ago. Well, there was a reason the outfitter let it go, we decided the land was not worth the price. Somebody may have leased it for that, but it is just one example of how the prices can be driven up.

Dear Loerd thats high. In Warren County I have heard a lot of folks grumbling that landowners want more than $8.00/acre. FWIW I am not anti-dog hunting.
 

DRS

Old Mossy Horns
I'm not grasping at straws.

I was told that by an NCWRC employee at the deer forum I went to.

Maybe the current batch of wildife enforcement officers would like to have a single buck limit to enforce? I don't know.

There are was to tell how long an animal has been dead. These people were either caught poaching or someone was speculating that the kills were illegal. Speculation is not fact.

Poaching can and will happen with or without the same buck limit state wide.

The main objective for the 2 buck limit is stated to better the age class of bucks. Same limit state wide and hunter preference are just other means of trying justify a change in regulation that has no biological reason to be changed. If hunters in NC haven't figured out our tag system in 17 or 11 years depending on where they hunt we are a sad group of people.

That takes us back to your argument that doe seasons have always been by county and can be different by county. The NCWRC even stated they may implement county season in some areas. This being said, if doe limits are not the same from county to county or even public land vs private land in the same county, how can a debate of a 2 buck limit statewide could even be defended by the reasoning to reduce poaching by means of a standard limit. Do we not care if does are getting poached?
 
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CRC

Old Mossy Horns
Poaching can and will happen with or without the same buck limit state wide.

From 1992-2000 there was a statewide 4 buck limit and there was still poaching. I fully agree with you.
 
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DRS

Old Mossy Horns
Dear Loerd thats high. In Warren County I have heard a lot of folks grumbling that landowners want more than $8.00/acre. FWIW I am not anti-dog hunting.

For what it is worth we also quit bidding on a tract when it went of $22/acre. I think it wound up bringing $26/acre.

Here in Nash some of our leases have gone to $8/acre. Thankfully, the land owner likes us because he was offered $15/acre. This is actually a different club and landowner that I mentioned in an earlier post about the land owner not leasing to an outfitter.
 

DRS

Old Mossy Horns
From 1992-2000 there was a statewide 4 buck limit and there was still poaching. I fully agree with you.



The statewide limit for does is 6 (excluding bonus tags).

3/4ths of the state have maximum seasons and the same limits on does.

Every hunter gets tags valid for 6 antlerless deer whether you hunt in Graham County or Bertie County.

You did forget about the game lands, many had doe seasons and they are in counties with the maximum doe season. Some public land bonus tags were not allowed for doe harvest. My point was to show a doe could be killed where illegal and presented as a legal kill from a different area. Same as you suggested as bucks due to a difference in limits between areas.
 

CRC

Old Mossy Horns
Right but the limit on game lands is 6 does max. Bonus tags are not legal for gl.

The antlered buck limit on game lands varies between 2 or 4.

How hard is it to shoot an 3rd or 4th buck in the 2 buck area and report them as killed on game lands in the 4 buck area if you have a game lands validation?
 

nccatfisher

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
Right but the limit on game lands is 6 does max. Bonus tags are not legal for gl.

The antlered buck limit on game lands varies between 2 or 4.

How hard is it to shoot an 3rd or 4th buck in the 2 buck area and report them as killed on game lands in the 4 buck area if you have a game lands validation?
How hard would it have been for me to shoot them here and say I killed them in SC since I have licenses and tags for there. If someone was going to do it illegal they are going to do it. I mean it would be especially easy for me since most of my hunting is on my own property and I never have to venture out on a state road, BUT the thought never even crossed my mind.

You can set there in the bat cave and dream op all kinds of scenarios of illegal hunting to bolster your agenda for two buck limits yet if someone wants to poach they will. Novel idea, they just shoot more then two with a two buck limit and don't report them. How often you think that happens and they just leave them to rot?
 

CRC

Old Mossy Horns
If someone was going to do it illegal they are going to do it.

I totally agree. I don't think poaching should factor in to changing the buck limit but with some at the NCWRC it seems to be a reason.
 

jug

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
All this talk about dog hunting makes me want to put in a plug for......
Albemarle Hunt club ;)
located in the Sandhills gameland area
one of the few clubs with plenty of private land to hunt in the area.
We have a couple of openings if anyone interested.
PM me if interested
 

bertienchunter

Twelve Pointer
Cost have went up and yes it is the landowners option to ask a set price or to take the highest bid for their land. All I am saying is support NC hunters first and stop the catering to out of state hunters. One club I hunted with in Halifax county was looking at leasing a 300 acre tract that and outfitter was giving up a lease. The land owner wanted what the outfitter had been paying $18/acre, by the way this was over a decade ago. Well, there was a reason the outfitter let it go, we decided the land was not worth the price. Somebody may have leased it for that, but it is just one example of how the prices can be driven up.

I seen outfitters run some to $26/acre in Bertie and Hertford. Its ridiculous. It wouldn't bother me if all of them lost every bit of land they have. In some ways I could see where the shorter season and two buck would hurt their business. I am on the fence about the buck rule just because I hope if it is passed some out of towners and out of staters will slow down coming to this area. On the other side I don't like the state telling me I have to go from 4 bucks to 2 bucks. I have killed 3 or 4 nice bucks in years past and I don't want to lose that option. In Va they have a 3 buck limit and I would be more for that than 2 buck.

I will say there are not near as many deer around as there have been in my area. They sure ain't behind every tree in Bertie like they used to be.
 

DRS

Old Mossy Horns
I seen outfitters run some to $26/acre in Bertie and Hertford. Its ridiculous. It wouldn't bother me if all of them lost every bit of land they have. In some ways I could see where the shorter season and two buck would hurt their business. I am on the fence about the buck rule just because I hope if it is passed some out of towners and out of staters will slow down coming to this area. On the other side I don't like the state telling me I have to go from 4 bucks to 2 bucks. I have killed 3 or 4 nice bucks in years past and I don't want to lose that option. In Va they have a 3 buck limit and I would be more for that than 2 buck.

I will say there are not near as many deer around as there have been in my area. They sure ain't behind every tree in Bertie like they used to be.

I concur, I could probably live with a 2 buck limit. That is, if it slowed down the demand for land in the region. I really don't think a 2 buck limit would slow down the non-residents coming in to hunt with outfitters though, being most only hunt for a week.

I just don't like to be told a regulation is for a specific reason, and the data don't back it up. That makes me wonder, if there is a hidden agenda. Being railroaded at the forum at NCC in Rocky Mount did not help alleviate any suspicions.
 

DRS

Old Mossy Horns
They did not ask that question, directly? Not in there survey or forum. I know out of the people I know most would rather have a 4 buck limit and dramatically reduce the doe harvest. An option not given.
 

CRC

Old Mossy Horns
At the end of the forum I attended they took questions/comments from those in attendance and didn't get negative push back to a 2 buck, 4 doe statewide limit.
 
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nccatfisher

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
At the end of the forum I attended they took questions/comments from those in attendance and didn't get negative push back to a 2 buck, 4 doe statewide limit.
How many did you attend in the 4 buck section of the state? :rolleyes:
 

DRS

Old Mossy Horns
Its why I asked.

Were they given a chance to comment on what was discussed?

Well, when I mentioned that the 1.5 year old buck harvest was 31%, near there goal of 30% I got railroaded. That was the point I really didn't care what they had to say. At the point the NCWRC ignore their own data, how I'm I suppose to believe anything else the NCWRC preaches.
 
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