Smokeless Conversion Platform

JJWise

JJWise

Twelve Pointer
Looking at getting a single shot 45-70 to be sent off and converted to a smokeless ML. What’s everyone’s opinions about the best model to use for this? I’m seeing some CVA Scouts (not V2) for under $350, pros & cons?

In a gun of that weight shooting those types of loads, how necessary is a muzzle break?
 
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brownisdown

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
I haven't seen any of the original scouts being converted in a while. Hankins Rifles does a bunch of the V2 guns. CVA is decent but there is a chance you get one with a tight barrel at the crown which will make you have to size bullets on the loose side which could lead to needing a wad. If you still plan to use sabots ignore that part. I would go with LRMP ignition system over the others hands down.

Encore conversions with the brux barrels from Arrowhead Rifles or Hankins Rifles are considerably nicer rigs but with the encore frames skyrocketing in price they aren't as economical as they once were.

Shooting 60 grains 4198 and a 275 grain bullet at roughly 2450 fps they are a handfull without a break. For a hunting gun that you don't intend to shoot off the bench much it's okay but if you like to tinker I would get it threaded for a break for bench work.

There may be a few new folks on the scene but Hankins is the only one I know of still converting a lot of break actions. Most of the others have quit that work and just build bolt guns.
 
JJWise

JJWise

Twelve Pointer
brownisdown said:
There may be a few new folks on the scene but Hankins is the only one I know of still converting a lot of break actions. Most of the others have quit that work and just build bolt guns.
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Hankins is who I was looking at, he offers V2’s ready to ship already converted and if he has any available once I’ve got the money saved up I’ll probably go that route. Seems to be hit or miss though like most things now, so if I’m going to need to ship him a gun to convert it would save me a couple bucks going with the original Scout.

I agree that the TC’s are probably better quality but like you said, they’ve really jumped up in price.
 

Packfan

Eight Pointer
You will want a break. Or you are going to have a headache.

If you got the $, an encore conversion with a BRUX barrel will allow the use of pre-sized bullets which will cut out several hundred of your cost in a purchasing sizing die.
 

L.P.

Four Pointer
Contributor
I've got a CVA converted scout from Scott Boger - Performance gun works in Yadkinville. He may be able to fix you up with one. I like mine, but it does kick alot without a brake on it but it is easier to load without having to mess with funnel to pour the powder in & it makes the rifle a little shorter & easier to handle in blinds. I shoot 65 gains of 4198 with 275 parker bullets,very accurate.
 
PPosey

PPosey

Twelve Pointer
They don't kick that bad if you still use a sabbot and a 200 or a 195 grain bullet 40 caliber bullet and a 45 cal barrel I have an H & R 45-70 converted that with a mild load is a cream puff to shoot. Supermag loads are not always the best answer.

My encore 45-70 conversion shoots 195 Barnes at 2400fps and isn't a bear to shoot. If I go up in speed so does the recoil.
 

brownisdown

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
PPosey said:
They don't kick that bad if you still use a sabbot and a 200 or a 195 grain bullet 40 caliber bullet and a 45 cal barrel I have an H & R 45-70 converted that with a mild load is a cream puff to shoot. Supermag loads are not always the best answer.

My encore 45-70 conversion shoots 195 Barnes at 2400fps and isn't a bear to shoot. If I go up in speed so does the recoil.
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For a pure hunting rig under 225 yards a sabot and 225 fury or Pittman is hard to beat for a soft shooter.
 

decoycarver

Six Pointer
I have sent two scout v2 to Hankins for conversion the last couple years. Both came back in about a week and both shoot sub moa at 100. I despise muzzle brakes but it is a handful without one.
 
PPosey

PPosey

Twelve Pointer
brownisdown said:
For a pure hunting rig under 225 yards a sabot and 225 fury or Pittman is hard to beat for a soft shooter.
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Its all about matching the bullet, the speed, and the game.

I load a 200 grain .40 xtp in a harvester baby blue sabot over 31 grains of 4759. Its a cream puff to shoot and a 100 yard deer killer.

I started using it when
a tree trashed my shoulder. Had been using 300 grain bullets and very stout loads. Deer died just as well with the cream puff load.

Now I shoot a 195 Barnes and a "moderate" powder load to get the 2400fps. The old shoulder more or less mended.
 

Buffet Trout

Twelve Pointer
Rumor has it that a regular 50 cal in-line capable of firing 150gr of pyrodex, such as a cva Kodiak magnum, can manage 20 grains of 5744 under a 240-250 sabot and thump a deer rather well at woods ranges.
 

brownisdown

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
JJWise said:
Just a rumor is it?
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Just because it's been done doesn't make it smart or safe. I've heard of guys using but dot on old inlines and that ain't bright either but it's their fingers and face not mine. Pressure rise and spikes are drastically different between blackpowder subs and smokeless powder.
 
PPosey

PPosey

Twelve Pointer
So what happens when you double load that sucker. I've been messing with smokeless MLs for a long time, there is very little forgiveness with smokeless. Non smokeless setups are not made to handle the what ifs. Their Breech plug designs are not made for it either.

Sure it will go boom. Do so at your own risk.
 
Jimbob78

Jimbob78

Twelve Pointer
What is the best receiver to use for a smokeless? I was looking at a defiance outcast after seeing the capabilities of these things.
 
PPosey

PPosey

Twelve Pointer
10-15 years ago Savage Ml2 with a pacnor .45 barrel if you want to push the limits and reach way out there.

I'm a convert to the break action design for hunting. Have a H&R and Encore pro hunter both 45-70 conversions. They will reach out and hammer a deer to 200 easy with a good load.

I load the H&R light. Several kids have taken their first deer with it. It is shorter and has a compact stock
 
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Jimbob78

Jimbob78

Twelve Pointer
PPosey said:
Savage Ml2 with a pacnor .45 barrel if you want to push the limits and reach way out there.

I'm a convert to the break action design for hunting. Have a H&R and Encore pro hunter both 45-70 conversions. They will reach out and hammer a deer to 200 easy with a good load.

I load the H&R light. Several kids have taken their first deer with it. It is shorter and has a compact stock
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Oh I will push the limits on distance, that’s why I was wondering about the defiance receiver. I’d like it to be exactly like my centerfire rifles and would probably put a Brux or bartlein on it.
 

brownisdown

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
Jimbob78 said:
Oh I will push the limits on distance, that’s why I was wondering about the defiance receiver. I’d like it to be exactly like my centerfire rifles and would probably put a Brux or bartlein on it.
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If you want to build a lightweight rig then the Defiance Ti helps. Otherwise I would go with an Arrowhead Obsidean (Rem 700 clone). I have an obsidian that is a Kelbley Atlas, one that is a true 700 clone and both are fantastic.
 
Billy

Billy

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
brownisdown said:
If you want to build a lightweight rig then the Defiance Ti helps. Otherwise I would go with an Arrowhead Obsidean (Rem 700 clone). I have an obsidian that is a Kelbley Atlas, one that is a true 700 clone and both are fantastic.
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By Rem 700 clone, are you referring to the original 700 ML?
 

brownisdown

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
Billy said:
By Rem 700 clone, are you referring to the original 700 ML?
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No, I'm referring to any of the custome actions that are "clones" or modeled after and with the same stock footprint as a rem 700 short action. The original 700ML cam still be converted but the latest and greatest technology is built on centerfire actions.
 
Billy

Billy

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
Thanks for the clarification. I had a 700 ML converted several years ago and have been very pleased with it, but I suspected you were referring to the centerfire actions.
 
Jimbob78

Jimbob78

Twelve Pointer
Billy said:
Thanks for the clarification. I had a 700 ML converted several years ago and have been very pleased with it, but I suspected you were referring to the centerfire actions.
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The aftermarket support is endless for the rem 700. I’m building one on a clone made by defiance machine.
 
Lucky Clucker

Lucky Clucker

Old Mossy Horns
Buffet Trout said:
Rumor has it that a regular 50 cal in-line capable of firing 150gr of pyrodex, such as a cva Kodiak magnum, can manage 20 grains of 5744 under a 240-250 sabot and thump a deer rather well at woods ranges.
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I shot blue dot inmy wolf. 22 gr. No kick but need sub base sabots it wouldn't group and blew.pettles off sabots. Went back to blackthorn 209
 
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