Newbie Muzzleloader and Blackhorn 209 Powder

Larry Eckart

Four Pointer
Guys,
I am a newbie to Muzzleloading.

I just ordered a CVA Optima from Gander Mountain with a dead on scope mount. I will put a Bushnell Banner scope on it. It will take about 15-30 days for Gander to get it me, according to the ticket. I'm fine with that. The price was great: $275 with a 10% online discount. What a deal!

Now I am sifting through the choices for bullet and powder.

It sounds like many guys like the Hornady XTP HP for a bullet. I'll probably start there. Sounds like Powerbelts have a poor reputation here.

Powder is more confusing to me.

While pellets are more convenient, it appears that there are many advantages to using Blackhorn 209. Those advantages include:
- cleaner burning; easier on the barrel
- ability to adapt your load, especially if you want less recoil at the range
- superior accuracy

I see that I need a different breech plug for my Optima if I go that route. No problem.

I am amazed that some guys seem to prefer NOT cleaning their barrel after every use but only after every season. Wow!

I am willing to start with Blackhorn, but I can't find anyplace that has it in stock.

Is this a seasonal problem or is it an ongoing issue?

I thank you for the time and look forward to participating in this forum.

Larry
 

stilker

Old Mossy Horns
It can be a little tough to find and not cheap but extremely clean and consistent and you can modify your breech plug with a drill bit.The optima is a great gun
 
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45/70 hunter

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
The Optima may come with the 209 breach plug. If it is a full length small hole you will need a different one for BH209. That plug will have a 5/16" hole about 3/4 of the way down. Powerbelts suck, I wouldn't take them if they were free. Pellets are easier but dirty. Black powder, Pyrodex, and BH209 allow you to tailor your loads for better groups. For the average hunter two pellets is easy, fast, and accurate enough. Hornady XTP's are my favorite but most any 240 gr to 300 gr bullet will work on deer. Oh and with BH209 don't use "muzzle loader" 209 primers they are weaker than shotgun 209 primers.
 

firedawg60

Twelve Pointer
Western Powders sold Blackhorn to Hodgdon and no one knows what that means for the future of Blackhorn. It is OOS everywhere online but still can be found in some local shops. I was in Sevierville two weeks ago and Bass Pro had a fair number of containers for $50. It's a great powder with easy cleanup but who knows if and when it will be available again.

Four of my last five deer have been taken with 80 grains BH and .44 cal 240 grain XTP. I think Midway has some 300 grainers in stock which get great reviews as well. CVA's generally have a .500-.501 bore so the crush rib sabot works well in most.
 

georgeeebuck

Ten Pointer
Blackhorn is in short supply as of now ,but so is about everything else that will go bang. If i had a new gun with nothing to shoot in it I would buy the first bottle of loose powder I came across (Blackhorn, 777, Pyoadex , black etc. or even pellets) . I would not thank that Hodgdon would discontinue Blackhorn because of it's popularity ,but may be impossible to find between how and muzzleloading season. I would use the same approach with primers and bullets ,grab the first ones that I came across. If I had a friend who shoots a muzzleloader I would beg or steal some of his stuff to get me through . In the long run try Blackhorn , Barnes ML and XTP bullets and different primers and load weights to see what shoots best. Good luck! PSA : someone said to modify a breech plug with a drill bit , being new to muzzleloaders or just smarter than the average bear I would not do that!!
 
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Papa_Smurf

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
I saw a couple of pound jugs of BH209 at the Conover WM about a month ago...no clue if it is still there, but i don't think the muzzleloading community has seen as many issues as the general firearm community with availability lately. As has been said, Blackhorn was bought by Hogdon, so the future is uncertain.

I use BH209 @ 100 grains by volume on the BH 209 tubes, with 300 grain Hornady SST projectiles, out of my Traditions .50. I'm happy with the performance and accuracy.
 

FishHunt

Old Mossy Horns
The XTP is a great bullet for hunting. I shot the 240gr XTP for about 20 years and never had a bad experience with that bullet. I am shooting 250gr SST now and it looks to be as good based on the deer I have shot and saw shot with that bullet.

BH209 is worth any hassle it takes to find it and shoot it. Weigh your charges and load your bullet to the same depth each time and your Optima will shoot as good as any gun you own. Small accurate digital scales can be purchased for less than $30.

Power Belts suck, I wouldn't shoot them at game animals if they gave them to me.

<>< Fish
 

stilker

Old Mossy Horns
Blackhorn is in short supply as of now ,but so is about everything else that will go bang. If i had a new gun with nothing to shoot in it I would buy the first bottle of loose powder I came across (Blackhorn, 777, Pyoadex , black etc. or even pellets) . I would not thank that Hodgdon would discontinue Blackhorn because of it's popularity ,but may be impossible to find between how and muzzleloading season. I would use the same approach with primers and bullets ,grab the first ones that I came across. If I had a friend who shoots a muzzleloader I would beg or steal some of his stuff to get me through . In the long run try Blackhorn , Barnes ML and XTP bullets and different primers and load weights to see what shoots best. Good luck! PSA : someone said to modify a breech plug with a drill bit , being new to muzzleloaders or just smarter than the average bear I would not do that!!
I don’t know if you’re smarter than a bear or not but Carlos at Ed’s gun shop is and he’s modified a bunch of them
 

firedawg60

Twelve Pointer
I think for the average "shoot a few rounds a year to check zero and kill a deer" person, drilling out to .035" or so is fine. People that shoot many pounds of powder a year and use vent liners generally toss them when they get to .035" due to excessive blowback and beginning of loss of accuracy.
 

Eric Revo

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
Or you can buy an already drilled one for the Optima from all kinda places. It will work with all bp substitutes in powder form.
 

georgeeebuck

Ten Pointer
I don’t know if you’re smarter than a bear or not but Carlos at Ed’s gun shop is and he’s modified a bunch of them
Yep I have no doubt Carlos could make it work well,Heck I have modified a few myself. But to suggest to a newbie to take a drill bit to a new breech plug just seems a little reckless to me.
 
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Crappie man

Six Pointer
When I bought my Accura a few years ago I had the breech plug drilled out for BH. I would have misfires occasionally and decided to get the CVA BH breech plug. Never had another misfire after that.
 

Larry Eckart

Four Pointer
Guys,
I really appreciate your good advice as I enter into muzzleloading.

Now I have to wait a few weeks for my gun to be delivered. Having a scope doesn't help much without the gun.

I live in Apex. Found 777 pellets at Bass Pro in Cary but every place I called has no Blackhorn 209. They do have 777 powder.

The only bullets I found available are Powerbelts. That will be OK for first target practice but I will later get Hornady's for hunting, when I can find them.

The several stores/gun shops I've checked do not have any 209 primers. It's a strange time. Fortunately, while I wait for my CVA to arrive there is lots of time to sharpen my woodsman skills.

I have enjoyed a couple editions of The Whitetail Hunter's Almanac by Dr. Ken Nordberg. That dude knows the woods and the whitetails!

It's funny. I have been an addicted duck hunter all my life. Now at age 66 I am back in school learning a new quarry, a new type of shooting, and all that goes with it. A great way to spend time in retirement!

Larry
 

bwfarms

Old Mossy Horns
You will have fun learning about your gun with the Powerbelts. My first shots were with Powerbelts and then I bought a couple of other brands to try. Up first I tried the Barnes and was so impressed I didn’t even bother seeing what the Hornady’s would do.
 

georgeeebuck

Ten Pointer
Guys,
I really appreciate your good advice as I enter into muzzleloading.

Now I have to wait a few weeks for my gun to be delivered. Having a scope doesn't help much without the gun.

I live in Apex. Found 777 pellets at Bass Pro in Cary but every place I called has no Blackhorn 209. They do have 777 powder.

The only bullets I found available are Powerbelts. That will be OK for first target practice but I will later get Hornady's for hunting, when I can find them.

The several stores/gun shops I've checked do not have any 209 primers. It's a strange time. Fortunately, while I wait for my CVA to arrive there is lots of time to sharpen my woodsman skills.

I have enjoyed a couple editions of The Whitetail Hunter's Almanac by Dr. Ken Nordberg. That dude knows the woods and the whitetails!

It's funny. I have been an addicted duck hunter all my life. Now at age 66 I am back in school learning a new quarry, a new type of shooting, and all that goes with it. A great way to spend time in retirement!

Larry
Good luck with your new gun. If you have any questions don't be shy about sending me a PM, I will make up something.:D
 

Mack in N.C.

Old Mossy Horns
Guys,
I really appreciate your good advice as I enter into muzzleloading.

Now I have to wait a few weeks for my gun to be delivered. Having a scope doesn't help much without the gun.

I live in Apex. Found 777 pellets at Bass Pro in Cary but every place I called has no Blackhorn 209. They do have 777 powder.

The only bullets I found available are Powerbelts. That will be OK for first target practice but I will later get Hornady's for hunting, when I can find them.

The several stores/gun shops I've checked do not have any 209 primers. It's a strange time. Fortunately, while I wait for my CVA to arrive there is lots of time to sharpen my woodsman skills.

I have enjoyed a couple editions of The Whitetail Hunter's Almanac by Dr. Ken Nordberg. That dude knows the woods and the whitetails!

It's funny. I have been an addicted duck hunter all my life. Now at age 66 I am back in school learning a new quarry, a new type of shooting, and all that goes with it. A great way to spend time in retirement!

Larry

Ditch the pellets and go with powder. Midway usa had Hornady xtp sabots in stock the other day.......those shoot great out of my inline.
 

Mack in N.C.

Old Mossy Horns
I just purchased 3 more 30 count boxes of the XTP Sabots from midway. They shoot great in my inline plus in a pinch the bullets are .452 which work perfect in my 45 colt .
 

pcbuckhunter

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
I did the same with the .429 and 44 Mag. Great minds lol.
If you’re going to be using the bullets for more than just your muzzleloader, check into buying the bullets and sabots individually.

This is what I do. I bought 2-100 ct boxes of Hornady .44 cal 240 gr XTP bullets for $21.99 each and 4- 50 ct pkgs of green crush rib sabots for $4.97 each in October.

That works out to $0.32 per bullet/sabot combo as opposed to $0.60 per bullet/sabot combo when buying them at $12/20 rd pack

It used to be even cheaper, the 100 ct box of XTP’s I’m working on now cost me $13.99 and the sabots $2.99 per 50. Which works out to about $0.21 per bullet/sabot combo
 

pccutter

Spike
For bullets go with harvester and their crushed rib sabot . It is like going from 777 to BH 209. I believe they have a 30 pack for under $15. I have two CVA and an traditions , they all shoot good with these bullets. I use to shoot the XTP's until I tried these. One of the guns 3 shoot 100yd group can be cover with a quarter and other two are not much larger.
 

Arapaho

Spike
Guys,
I really appreciate your good advice as I enter into muzzleloading.

Now I have to wait a few weeks for my gun to be delivered. Having a scope doesn't help much without the gun.

I live in Apex. Found 777 pellets at Bass Pro in Cary but every place I called has no Blackhorn 209. They do have 777 powder.

The only bullets I found available are Powerbelts. That will be OK for first target practice but I will later get Hornady's for hunting, when I can find them.

The several stores/gun shops I've checked do not have any 209 primers. It's a strange time. Fortunately, while I wait for my CVA to arrive there is lots of time to sharpen my woodsman skills.

I have enjoyed a couple editions of The Whitetail Hunter's Almanac by Dr. Ken Nordberg. That dude knows the woods and the whitetails!

It's funny. I have been an addicted duck hunter all my life. Now at age 66 I am back in school learning a new quarry, a new type of shooting, and all that goes with it. A great way to spend time in retirement!

Larry
Not sure where you are located but muzzle loader primers should work with triple 7. I always just use shotgun primers but I know they are hard to find. I would be willing to give up a pack of muzzle loader primers if you are not too far away. Located in Burlington.
 

Clifford66

Button Buck
Guys,
I really appreciate your good advice as I enter into muzzleloading.

Now I have to wait a few weeks for my gun to be delivered. Having a scope doesn't help much without the gun.

I live in Apex. Found 777 pellets at Bass Pro in Cary but every place I called has no Blackhorn 209. They do have 777 powder.

The only bullets I found available are Powerbelts. That will be OK for first target practice but I will later get Hornady's for hunting, when I can find them.

The several stores/gun shops I've checked do not have any 209 primers. It's a strange time. Fortunately, while I wait for my CVA to arrive there is lots of time to sharpen my woodsman skills.

I have enjoyed a couple editions of The Whitetail Hunter's Almanac by Dr. Ken Nordberg. That dude knows the woods and the whitetails!

It's funny. I have been an addicted duck hunter all my life. Now at age 66 I am back in school learning a new quarry, a new type of shooting, and all that goes with it. A great way to spend time in retirement!

Larry
Hi Larry, I live in Apex also. I have stuff I've accumulated over the years from after deer season sales - 250 and 300 grain hornady xtp bullets, MMP sabots, caps, powder - BH209, pyrodex RS & P, triple 7, regular shotgun primers. My experience is that a 250 or 300 grain hornady xtp bullet with a MMP short black sabot works. Let me know if I can help you.
 
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