future of dogs in Holly Shelter

DRS

Old Mossy Horns
In papohead's case sounds like he is dealing with a whole bunch of other problems other than dog hunters, just using dog hunting as a reason the hunting was crappy. Dead dogs in the road, yes they sometimes get hit. However, that is why we're are seen beside these roads sometime trying to not have this happen. Poor looking dogs, most people would call a well conditioned hound "poor", because they are not over weight. There is a fine line between the two. The main difference is performance and I don't see many hunting with a hound that can't perform. Yes, there are those scum of the earth that have dogs and don't care(about anything), but the are not limited to one aspect of life. To the extent of people in deer stands, blinds, boats, bars, golf courses and even the animal rightest and other people that will take a collar off a dog let it go or relocate it.

The two links below one on dog hunting deer at DOE SRS and an article on research done on deer movement due to hunting pressure in PA.

http://scholarworks.sfasu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1289&context=forestry

http://www.outdoornews.com/March-2015/Deer-ly-departed-Deer-go-where-hunters-arent/

All my life I have hunted in deer dog country. I have noticed that deer react negatively more to people in the woods that dogs. We could dog hunt the small tracts (about 800 acres of 2000 acres we lease) and just a me and a few more could stand hunt and deer would be seem on a regular basis even after the dog hunts. That would all change when nearly all 20+ members would stand hunt when most members were on vacation. We would not dog hunt at any greater or lesser frequency, the only difference was the number of people. After that week or two with just a few of us hunting the deer would resume normal movement, while we still dog hunted the same with the same amount of hounds. I have noticed this year after year for over 2 decades. The same with a stand that gets hunted to death. Guys seeing deer and they keep hunting and killing deer. The deer start to avoid the area. The guys stop hunting the area. Let things claim a few days, slip back in there and there will be deer, with no completion with the other guys in the club.

One thing I have learned is how to hunt around other people and how to use that to my advantage.
 
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Deerhuntr

Ten Pointer
All I really can say on the matter is I hunt an area that we routinely run with dogs and I stll kill deer both ways. And I ain't talking about thousands of acres either.
 

Southside

Ten Pointer
Isn't the trap and/or skeet range papohead is taking about private? I just know that somewhere within HS GL there is some private land that a shooting club uses.
 

Ryan

Guest
I think if you ventured out on the lands on holly shelter you can get in deer, there is so much wetland there that i bet there's place in that swamp that haven't seen a person or dog, I'm a still hunter, i don't have a problem with dog hunters that respect the sport and do it properly, If there are dog hunters here that will take in a dog found on gameland I would like your contact information. I don't have the dog anymore but I found an abandoned injured treeing hound on Angola bay game-land and that did make me upset to see a hunting dog clearly abandoned and the colar off it as well, I imagine that I may run into this situation again and if any of you on here will take in an abandoned dog let me know so if I find another I can get in contact with you.
 

darkthirty

Old Mossy Horns
Maybe you need to re-transplant yourself back to MO if you don't like the way we hunt in NC. I've seen some poor looking and dead deer dogs also. But guess what genius, I've seen some really poor looking and dead "pets" on the side of the road. Don't use the dogs welfare as a scapegoat. You don't like dog hunting and you want it stopped because you're concerned about the dog's welfare. Don't hand me that, why arnt you concerned about the poodle's and Pit Bull's that arnt taking care of either? I've lived in North Carolina my whole life and hunted with hounds equally as long. This state made it just fine for many many years without you living here and is fully capable of making it many more. If you don't like the way we hunt in North Carolina maybe you need to......"Head west young man". After all, you said so yourself. No one in MO hunts deer with dogs. If that's the promise land, please:head back.

Like I said before: take the anti-dog hunting stuff somewhere else. Maybe I'll start bashing something you love to do.

Exactly what part was so "anti-dogging" that you deemed it necessary to give the response you did???? The way I read it, he stayed very civil. Your response was totally over the top. I support dog hunting, been there, done it, enjoyed it. But it seems like he has a point. I've seen some dogs that were poor as hell in dog boxes and I would be ashamed to be seen with. If I can count the freaking vertebrate on a deer hound, then he is mal-nourished. You never saw the hip pointers or backbones on my dogs, but yet they could hang with any of the under fed dogs.
Instead of belittling him, why not invite him to hunt with you. Attitudes like yours will be what speeds up the inevitable. Banning dogging. It's coming whether you or I or anyone else agrees with it. Why not do what you can to prolong it as long as possible. If that means calling out a fellow houndsman then so be it. But the whole,"if you don't like it, move back to where you come from" phrase does nothing but throw fuel to an already burning fire. Don't believe me? Ask the hog farmers in this state how that's working out for them.
Thing to remember also, is that non doggers see many more bad deer doggers in person than on a internet forum. So what if everyone on here is responsible doggers, that holds very little validity if all you ever see in person are the bad ones. So keep that in mind also.
 
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wildcat3

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
Ever seen a poor Black Lab? I have. Guess what....they're not used as deer dogs. Ever seen a poor Pitbull? I have. Guess what....They're not used as deer dogs either. Ever seen a poor rail thin mixed up mut? You get it by now surely. Yes my response was harsh but look at it from my point of view. I've hunted with hounds my entire life. I take A1 care of my dogs and hunt as legally and ethically as anyone in North Carolina. North Carolina has been a hound hunting state for centuries. Not just deer dogging but dog hunting in general. I simply don't believe in telling others what they should do or should not be allowed to do. Just because it wasn't or was done a certain way back home doesn't make it wrong here, doesn't make it right for that matter...I'll play both sides. I still hunt some, very little but I will sit a couple of times a year on the farm. I don't believe in "baiting" for deer. I ask you to find one thread on this entire message forum in which I've taken it upon myself to bash hunters who "bait" or "corn" deer. You'll be searching for a long time because there isn't one. Yes, I come off strong and stern to anyone making negative comments about dog hunting. I'm very passionate about it and have no intentions to apologize for what I said, I still feel the same way about it.
 

DRS

Old Mossy Horns
Sometimes, I wish that deer hunters, that don't dog hunt, were judged by what poachers and other disrespectful people do.

I really don't because that is wrong! I also a deer dog hunter don't like to be stereotyped and I am glad some here don't. Just ask those that know me, if I'm vocal and police those I hunt around. Thank goodness, I hunt with two good groups of hunters. However, I can never control ones actions and if you think you can your wrong. You can only react to what has been done.
 
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wildcat3

Twelve Pointer
Contributor
Back when I was dog hunting hard, in 3 clubs. One of which opened Sept 15th I had some real deer dogs. I was hunting 3 days a week towards the end of the season when my business slowed down around the holidays, double edge sword right there. Anyway, on two different occasions I carried 2 die hard still hunters with me. They were like a lot of folks on here, didn't grow up dog hunting or new to the area. One was very vocal about his dislike for it but he and I are good friends and he had just about hunted out his places as it was late in the season by this point. About the first time he heard the woods echoing from about 15 head of Walkers and then heard the dead leaves and sticks breaking before he saw two does come by he was hooked. He didn't give up still hunting but from then on up until the time I got out of the clubs he went with me at least twice a season.
 

NCDoberman

Ten Pointer
Sometimes, I wish that deer hunters, that don't dog hunt, were judged by what poachers and other disrespectful people do.

.

We are. Cecil is a good example of it.

But, I agree with your point. Unfortunately, as with all things in life, the bad apples tend to stick out more than those who do things the right way.

Personally, I've met and know "good" and "bad" deer doggers. I became aware of the "bad" ones first so that shaped my opinion. DRS, you and some of the others on here have helped that opinion shift a good deal in a positive direction.

I will say this though, taking a "if you don't like it, then leave" attitude is shooting yourself in the foot. Doggers need as many allies as they can get as do all hunters and lashing out at potiential allies who's limited exposure to deer dogging has been negative is a sure fire way to make an enemy out of a possible friend real quick.
 

nchunt101

Ten Pointer
Sometimes, I wish that deer hunters, that don't dog hunt, were judged by what poachers and other disrespectful people do.

I really don't because that is wrong! I also a deer dog hunter don't like to be stereotyped and I am glad some here don't. Just ask those that know me, if I'm vocal and police those I hunt around. Thank goodness, I hunt with two good groups of hunters. However, I can never control ones actions and if you think you can your wrong. You can only react to what has been done.

I blame still hunters just as much---dealing with a turd of one right now. That said unless you catch them dead in the act you will likely never know about the still hunter being there. That said when dog hunters rut up roads, cut fences, dump dogs over fences it is a little more obvious and much more $$$$ to the private landowner to fix. I unfortunately have land in the general area that some of the worst dog clubs operate in (so bad the majority of the clubs around here will not associate with them). I have heard horror stories about both types of hunters and realize that a rouge hunter is a POS no matter how he hunts.
 

jump dog

Four Pointer
I know this is old thread.
But I get excited when I'm in a stand and I hear dogs get dumped out.
The deer come by me.
Saves me a lot of wasted time. If I don't see any they were not in there before the dogs were dropped. And I was wasting time.
Plus sometimes you catch them sneaking around dogs. The dogs will line 1 out. Other deer will slip back around them. Dog hunting is win win situation for someone without dogs. On public land they don't care if you shoot a deer in front of their dogs. The dogs will just go start another one. If you know the woods and deer trails someone else's dogs are a definite help. Especially the guys that run the slow beagles. Hehehe. Those deer will run around in circles
And never leave. I think most people that complain about dogs don't really hunt alot or understand how the dogs work and what's about to happen.
Otherwise they would know to stay in woods. Deer are gonna have to move
to stay away from dogs.
I have 169 acre farm. I could not tell you the number of still hunters I have had to run out. I even had one tell me God gave him the right to hunt on the whole earth. I told him to tell it to the sheriff. And he did. Sheriff wrote him a trespassing ticket. Lol.
Never had 1 problem with dog hunters trying to turn out.
I have had dogs run across me tufned out from somewhere else. I got the doe and let the guys get their dogs. No problems.
My experience as a landowner has been way worse with still hunters.
I have to go find them on my farm.
Now my human presence in woods looking for them has spooked my deer.
One thing for sure. If dog hunting goes. Hunters without dogs are the next target for the anti hunters.
Food for thought.
 

Cam

Four Pointer
One reason I can not stand dog hunting---I like peace and quiet. I hear way to much loud stuff and whooping and hollering at work. The main reason I hunt now is just to decompress.
You can sit in the woods without being deer hunting year round
 
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