Flounder 2021

HotSoup

Old Mossy Horns
Well.....they are atit again. Word is re recreational limit reduction to 1.....YES ONE per day. When are WE going to say enough is enough. Its historically accurate that once they take they don't give back. I'm so sick of this I probably won't be renewing my license. I spend THOUSANDS of dollars a year to fish at the beach....for what.

1 gray trout
1 drum
4 specs
No flounder 46 weeks out of the year
3 blues....aka bait
 

Ho ace

Ten Pointer
Contributor
Wouldn't be surprised if its a slot 1 fish limit....

I'm with you this has gotten out of hand.
 

JFH3006

Ten Pointer
I do not understand why they hit the recreational fisherman. I do not see it worth the time and expense to drive and keep a few fish. Sportsmen spend a lot of money in the area but this will be decreased in the future. I know commercial is a business but the resources should be for all.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Mr.Gadget

Old Mossy Horns
Yep it sure is taking the fun out of it.

At one time it would bug me to see people keep fish.

This past fall seen several clean and eat flounder on the beach.
Thats what happens when they do these stupid laws.
 

oldest school

Old Mossy Horns
well poachers gonna poach or so i have been told here repeatedly.
Stupid laws have nothing to do with it. according to those that are experts on the matter.

i have always been surprised by the folks that do not take fish limits to be "for them"
It seems the more expense involved the less likely they are to abide by the rules.
Stripers in the Chesapeake comes to mind. catch a limit haul ass to the bank, repeat.
Perhaps this is the rich man, new coastal residents way to keep the "riff raff" off their water?
Waters getting too crowded for them.
So far the new limits havent done anything but send more boats to the water.
 

Mr.Gadget

Old Mossy Horns
well poachers gonna poach or so i have been told here repeatedly.
Stupid laws have nothing to do with it. according to those that are experts on the matter.

i have always been surprised by the folks that do not take fish limits to be "for them"
It seems the more expense involved the less likely they are to abide by the rules.

I think there is a small difference.
When they let people makeing money from the fish have their way but the common surf fisher is told they can not keep any it is different.
 

Thomas270

Ten Pointer
Will knock me out from flounder gigging with just one buddy, will definitely be carrying my wife, daughter, 2 nieces and 1 nephew, all my coworkers kids. Does anybody know much a 24 ft flat bottom skiff draws by chance? 🤣
 

dc bigdaddy

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
Will knock me out from flounder gigging with just one buddy, will definitely be carrying my wife, daughter, 2 nieces and 1 nephew, all my coworkers kids. Does anybody know much a 24 ft flat bottom skiff draws by chance? 🤣

that boat's gonna be crowded.
 

HotSoup

Old Mossy Horns
Well....what do you know. "Ocean" Flounder season was just opened for the commercial side for the month of December. This sickens me to the point of rage...
 

Steelshot

Eight Pointer
I’d like to see the numbers that support this action. Crazy how every year with tighter restrictions the situation gets worse to warrant the next years tighter regs.
 

oldest school

Old Mossy Horns
Well....what do you know. "Ocean" Flounder season was just opened for the commercial side for the month of December. This sickens me to the point of rage...
is it because you think there isnt enough flounder to support the ocean season ;or that the coms get a season and the recs do/did not?
 

HotSoup

Old Mossy Horns
is it because you think there isnt enough flounder to support the ocean season ;or that the coms get a season and the recs do/did not?

Yes....supposedly we need a 6 week season because there are so few left. At the drop of a hat however, the commercial side gets an opening.
 

Steelshot

Eight Pointer
I just don’t see the amount of flounder that are harvested by rec fishing being more than what is harvested by commercial fishing. I mean even if I get a rec limit everyday and each fish weighted 10lbs my math don’t add up to 20,000lbs. I guess the argument that can be made is there is way more rec fishing than commercial fishing boats, but 20,000 lbs x 100 boats = 2,000,000 lbs. again I just don’t see rec anglers catching more than that in a 6 week season. Maybe a commercial guy can chime in. Not picking a fight just curious.( I just used 100 boats as an example I have no clue how many do it)
 

HotSoup

Old Mossy Horns
I just don’t see the amount of flounder that are harvested by rec fishing being more than what is harvested by commercial fishing. I mean even if I get a rec limit everyday and each fish weighted 10lbs my math don’t add up to 20,000lbs. I guess the argument that can be made is there is way more rec fishing than commercial fishing boats, but 20,000 lbs x 100 boats = 2,000,000 lbs. again I just don’t see rec anglers catching more than that in a 6 week season. Maybe a commercial guy can chime in. Not picking a fight just curious.( I just used 100 boats as an example I have no clue how many do it)

Its all about the $$$ and until we as rec anglers hit them in the wallet it will continue
 

Wanchese

Twelve Pointer
Don't know but they are allowed 20,000 lbs.
They are not the same species of flounder as what being caught by the majority of people here in NC. I have tried to explain this several times on here. The fish being landed here in that fishery are caught by trawlers off the coast of New England. None of them are being caught anywhere near NC. They land/sell them here because that is where their permit to land requires them to be unloaded. It is a federally managed fishery, each state has a allocated quota and to land in that state you have to have federal permit for that state. All NC does is open and close the landing period.


I’ve commercial fished all my life in NC but I can’t catch or sell those fish.
 

Wanchese

Twelve Pointer
I just don’t see the amount of flounder that are harvested by rec fishing being more than what is harvested by commercial fishing. I mean even if I get a rec limit everyday and each fish weighted 10lbs my math don’t add up to 20,000lbs. I guess the argument that can be made is there is way more rec fishing than commercial fishing boats, but 20,000 lbs x 100 boats = 2,000,000 lbs. again I just don’t see rec anglers catching more than that in a 6 week season. Maybe a commercial guy can chime in. Not picking a fight just curious.( I just used 100 boats as an example I have no clue how many do it)
See my post above.

That fishery is in no way, shape or form related to the fishery here in our sounds. I doubt any commercial operation in our sound caught 20,000 pounds total during the entire season this year. Those boats are going to catch that in a day or two and likely have a limit for any other state they have a permit for. NC and VA usually set the landing dates so that they can go up there, catch the fish, steam to VA and unload that limit, then come to NC and unload that limit.
 

oldest school

Old Mossy Horns
Its all about the $$$ and until we as rec anglers hit them in the wallet it will continue
i dont see how you do that? of course i am not sure who "them: is.
It seems very crowded on the rec side now.
Maybe because if you go you can catch some whether you can kill them or not?
 

Steelshot

Eight Pointer
See my post above.

That fishery is in no way, shape or form related to the fishery here in our sounds. I doubt any commercial operation in our sound caught 20,000 pounds total during the entire season this year. Those boats are going to catch that in a day or two and likely have a limit for any other state they have a permit for. NC and VA usually set the landing dates so that they can go up there, catch the fish, steam to VA and unload that limit, then come to NC and unload that limit.
Gotcha. Didn’t see this post when I made my comment.
 

boomer

Twelve Pointer
It is sad that recreational fisherman seem to always carry the burden of reduced fish stocks. Maybe if coastal fishing was managed like hunting is ,there maybe more fish to catch. Hunting regs banned commercial hunting in order to save deer , turkey ,and waterfowl. When it happened it probably cost folks their jobs but look at the jobs created, guides, tv shows, deer shows, duck calls etc. . All I am saying is look at long term instead of short term. Market hunting almost ruined wildlife stocks, buffalo for example, when market hunting ended then wildlife rebounded. Just my 2 cents worth. It maybe time to change how commercial fishing is done to help save fish stock.
 

darkthirty

Old Mossy Horns
Another thing to remember when comparing commercial to rec fishing. Agencies can keep a fairly close eye on the actual numbers of whatever species the commercial guys are harvesting. It is damn near impossible to do that with recreational angling. You can argue that commercial guys don’t report everything. That may be true in terms of what don’t come in to the dock but the catches are still documented 100 x’s better than even the best estimates of what rec anglers are harvesting. That plays a big role in why the rec anglers “appear” to be getting the crappier end of the deal.
 

oldest school

Old Mossy Horns
It is sad that recreational fisherman seem to always carry the burden of reduced fish stocks. Maybe if coastal fishing was managed like hunting is ,there maybe more fish to catch. Hunting regs banned commercial hunting in order to save deer , turkey ,and waterfowl. When it happened it probably cost folks their jobs but look at the jobs created, guides, tv shows, deer shows, duck calls etc. . All I am saying is look at long term instead of short term. Market hunting almost ruined wildlife stocks, buffalo for example, when market hunting ended then wildlife rebounded. Just my 2 cents worth. It maybe time to change how commercial fishing is done to help save fish stock.
they (recs) also kill most of the trout redfish and maybe even flounder excluding the unkown throw away by coms.
Recs can have their cake in terms of catching plenty of fish they just can't have the cake and eat it too, :)
I guess because there are more of recs: but they seem to me to be greedier than the coms who after all are trying to make a living. Just my opinion.
 

sky hawk

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
they (recs) also kill most of the trout redfish and maybe even flounder excluding the unkown throw away by coms.

I don't believe that. In some situations, a majority of the fish are not legal fish, or in the case of trout and drum, the angler may have already reached their limit. Those fish are thrown back, and a large majority of those survive. Now with flounder being closed, recs can't keep ANY for 10 1/2 months. That statement just isn't true. Many recs end up having to throw back most of their fish even when they are looking for dinner.

Compare that to comm, where many of the non-target and undersized species are dead when landed and thrown overboard as bycatch.
 

Sportsman

Old Mossy Horns
For the record, I have caught over 400 trout since April. I have kept 16-24 of those fish. I've probably caught 30-40 slot drum....didn't keep a single one. Haven't caught but one flounder (haven't targeted them). I realize that I may be in the minority, but I have several friends that I fish with/around who, like me, release 95% of what they catch. I understand a lot of folks keep fish but I can't imagine so many are keeping so many fish that Recs have more of an impact on the population than Comms.
 

oldest school

Old Mossy Horns
I don't believe that. In some situations, a majority of the fish are not legal fish, or in the case of trout and drum, the angler may have already reached their limit. Those fish are thrown back, and a large majority of those survive. Now with flounder being closed, recs can't keep ANY for 10 1/2 months. That statement just isn't true. Many recs end up having to throw back most of their fish even when they are looking for dinner.

Compare that to comm, where many of the non-target and undersized species are dead when landed and thrown overboard as bycatch.
well i think that is indisputable if you believe the harvest numbers which of course no one on either side believes if it doesnt fit their argument.
I think the last time i looked it was 60% rec harvest. on those species. So alll along it seemed to me that the recs were in control of their own destiny.

But as I said no one believes rec harvest numbers that are captured per surveys.
Except of course the folks making the regs.
 

sky hawk

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
well i think that is indisputable if you believe the harvest numbers which of course no one on either side believes if it doesnt fit their argument.
I think the last time i looked it was 60% rec harvest. on those species. So alll along it seemed to me that the recs were in control of their own destiny.

But as I said no one believes rec harvest numbers that are captured per surveys.
Except of course the folks making the regs.
Sorry, OS, I misread your post. You meant recs are responsible for the majority of harvest. I thought you wrote recs kill most of the fish they catch. As in, they never throw any back. And no, I don't trust the rec harvest numbers at all, I'll just have to take their word for it.

If you want to estimate impact on the fishery by each side, you need to include all of the mortality induced. That is harvest + release mortality for recs and harvest + bycatch for comms. That non-harvest mortality can be huge in certain types of fishing, (i.e. shrimp trawls), but much less in others. Outside of maybe summertime striped bass fishing, I would say the release mortality for recs is lower than most types of commercial gear.
 

HotSoup

Old Mossy Horns
the latest news....proposal to reduce limit to 1 per day.

Once they take, they will not give back.
 
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