Anybody have a copy of Mike Seamster's book on NC wild turkey history?

woodmoose

Administrator
Staff member
Contributor
#3
I used the data from it a while ago during one of the many "great debates" on turkeys,,,,,,,,,,,,that "changes to turkey season" thread you started a few months ago,,,,,,,,
 
Last edited:

oldest school

Old Mossy Horns
#5
thanks to both of you for mentioning this.

I have a question for anyone.

In the early part of this book it is said that the population was decimated by loss of habitat and uncontrolled hunting early in the early 1900s.
I cannot fathom a lack of habitat in the early 1900s? In NC.

what am i missing?
 

woodmoose

Administrator
Staff member
Contributor
#6
thanks to both of you for mentioning this.

I have a question for anyone.

In the early part of this book it is said that the population was decimated by loss of habitat and uncontrolled hunting early in the early 1900s.
I cannot fathom a lack of habitat in the early 1900s? In NC.

what am i missing?

tons of cleared farm land that has since grown back into trees,,,,,,,,
 

rodman

Six Pointer
#10
tons of cleared farm land that has since grown back into trees,,,,,,,,
Oldest school I heard from a good source that years ago they cleared a tract near Goldston and you could see turkey eggs coming over the blade of a small bulldozer when they was clearing
 
#11
i could understand loss of habitat since the population exploded in NC.

but there wasnt enough people in the state in 1917 to clear enough land to run the turkeys out of habitat.

plus if they did clear and farm isnt that exactly the habitat they thrive in?
 

woodmoose

Administrator
Staff member
Contributor
#12
they didn't clear it in 1917,,,,,,,they started clearing land in NC in the 1600s and pretty much kept at it,,,,,,,most people farmed in some manner or another,,,,,trees were cut for homes, barns etc etc etc,,,,,conservation was never heard of as there was 'always more trees",,,,,,,,

but hey,,,,you tell me why there was no habitat since you didn't like my answer,,,,,,
 
Last edited:

Justin

Old Mossy Horns
#13
Woodmoose is spot on, as ALWAYS. There are far more trees today than there were 100 years ago. Heck, look at civil war battle field photos then vs now. I'd hardly say it was suitable habitat. Those battle fields didn't get cut down and trimmed just for war, it was how things were. Where's a turkey to roost? Fall and winter mast? It's not that hard to understand why big game especially, (turkeys included) weren't around much. Everything was farmed or cut for timber or grazed. I think they small game hay days in mid century 1900s were due to a few things, one less grazing, but still enough farming to provide food and stuff was starting to be left alone for early successional habitat to form.
 
#14
i know you guys want to argue over this. it's what you do. You are a heallvu tag team when you gang on on someone so i concede.


there are more trees now than in the early 1900s. OK if you say so.

not sure how i could have been so stupid.
 

turkeyfoot

Twelve Pointer
#15
As the population grows and developments keep popping up so goes lot habitat that would be great for turkeys it's quite amazing we have as many birds as we do in this state to me
 

CRC

Old Mossy Horns
Thread starter #16
I've seen birds in Asheville right in town. They are pretty adaptable, way more adaptable than folks used to think.
 

Justin

Old Mossy Horns
#17
i know you guys want to argue over this. it's what you do. You are a heallvu tag team when you gang on on someone so i concede.


there are more trees now than in the early 1900s. OK if you say so.

not sure how i could have been so stupid.
Aerial and historic photography for one. Yes aerial photography goes way back. I've personally seen it back into the early 30s.

Everything was made of wood back then, and very little recycling. Ships, infrastructure to include road paving itself, fuel (not everyone burned coal for powering steam turbines and such.

Far far less efficient farming practices that needed more acreage for less output.

Less man aided reforestation in those areas clear cut.

You think about being self sufficient, and I don't mean Daniel Boone style, I mean typcical family farm, trees didn't do squat for you. Open pasture and land to til did. How many barbed wore fences have you come across in the woods, and do you think they were grazing hardwoods, or the fence remnants held on after everything started growing back up?

Fire suppression had increased forested areas. Did you know that in several states there's a push for local type prairie restorations due to forestation?

It's really not that hard to grasp, you just have to be made aware of facts and not always go on what YOU may THINK.
 
Last edited:

woodmoose

Administrator
Staff member
Contributor
#18
i know you guys want to argue over this. it's what you do. You are a heallvu tag team when you gang on on someone so i concede.


there are more trees now than in the early 1900s. OK if you say so.

not sure how i could have been so stupid.
all I can say is WOW,,,,,,

you asked a question - I provided an answer - you didn't like that answer and said I was wrong - I provided additional info and asked if I am wrong, what's your input on it,,,,somebody else provided additional info that happened to support my input and you blow up,,,,

if that's arguing, then I'll just have to shake my head,,,,I considered it a discussion,,,,,,,

but you got it,,,,,,thanks
 

lasttombstone

Old Mossy Horns
Contributor
#19
As to the original topic, I will add, has anyone ever SEEN a copy of said book? I have read some of it on the provided link but I would really rather hold a book and turn a page but can't seem to find any reference to the book for sale.
 

woodmoose

Administrator
Staff member
Contributor
#20
As to the original topic, I will add, has anyone ever SEEN a copy of said book? I have read some of it on the provided link but I would really rather hold a book and turn a page but can't seem to find any reference to the book for sale.

I don't believe it's for sale that I am aware of - I printed the pdf and put it in a small 3 ring binder for my bookshelf
 

wolfman

Twelve Pointer
#24
Is there anywhere in NC where the forest is original? I don't think so except possibly part of dismal swamp? I think everything had been cut at one point by the early settlers.
 

hawglips

Old Mossy Horns
#26
I have a question for anyone.

In the early part of this book it is said that the population was decimated by loss of habitat and uncontrolled hunting early in the early 1900s.
I cannot fathom a lack of habitat in the early 1900s? In NC.

what am i missing?


https://www.mnn.com/earth-matters/w...-trees-than-there-were-100-years-ago-its-true

https://www.pghcitypaper.com/pittsb...ntirely-stripped-of-trees/Content?oid=1848219

http://www.upworthy.com/america-has...n-100-years-but-were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet
 
#27
all I can say is WOW,,,,,,

you asked a question - I provided an answer - you didn't like that answer and said I was wrong - I provided additional info and asked if I am wrong, what's your input on it,,,,somebody else provided additional info that happened to support my input and you blow up,,,,

if that's arguing, then I'll just have to shake my head,,,,I considered it a discussion,,,,,,,

but you got it,,,,,,thanks
i wasnt even talkking directly to you or your infpormation merely stating a possible misconception on my part.

with only two millon people in the state in 1900 and almost 11 million today it is hard to conceive more trees here today.

in my half century i have only seen woods destroyed for big ag and urban sprawl.

a quick google search yield conflicting "facts" on teh amount of trees now versus "then"

and there is a another school of thought on how the lack of forest was or was not a factor.

but at some point the effort isnt worth it. the level reached here talking about turkey populations is absurd.

beneath us all.
 

Justin

Old Mossy Horns
#28
Photographic evidence exists. I've told you what to look for to see it. You seem to think it's a personal attack on you, when it's just fact pointing. I can't tell you anything about the turkey populations then vs now. I won't comment on what I don't know about, so trees and forestation will be the extent. Carry on.