2020 Permit Draw

Roanoke

Roanoke

Eight Pointer
NC needs more public land for hunters. Our population continues to increase and there is not enough land. We are three generations removed for the farm now and there are not as many small family farms. Most people have sold their family land so the amount of hunters that are landowners is constantly declining. It will only get worst as more Eastern counties try and push blind laws. Just a few years ago you could pull several waterfowl permits from the leftover results. Now there is nothing.
 
Last edited:
coachcornbread

coachcornbread

Ten Pointer
Roanoke said:
NC needs more public land for hunters. Our population continues to increase and there is not enough land. We are three generations removed for the farm now and there are not as many small family farms. Most people have sold their family land so the amount of hunters that are landowners is constantly declining. It will only get worst as more Eastern counties try and push blind laws. Just a few years ago you could pull several waterfowl permits from the leftover results. Now there is nothing.
Click to expand...

I agree partially with your post, but I don’t think the issue is access to public land, it’s access to quality public land. There’s nowhere for birds to sit in sounds or lakes that has anything for them to eat unless it’s poured out of a bag. I fished damn near the entire shoreline of Pamlico and Hyde Counties this summer and can count on one hand the number of places I had to clean grass off my hooks. As far as public impoundments go, I wish they would go with a 12 pm cutoff time and limit people to 20 shells. That would solve a lot of the problems right there.
 
Clark

Clark

Ten Pointer
coachcornbread said:
I agree partially with your post, but I don’t think the issue is access to public land, it’s access to quality public land. There’s nowhere for birds to sit in sounds or lakes that has anything for them to eat unless it’s poured out of a bag. I fished damn near the entire shoreline of Pamlico and Hyde Counties this summer and can count on one hand the number of places I had to clean grass off my hooks. As far as public impoundments go, I wish they would go with a 12 pm cutoff time and limit people to 20 shells. That would solve a lot of the problems right there.
Click to expand...

Used to hunt the ponds 3x week from dawn to dusk with great success. Now it is 2x a week until 1:00 with crappy hunting. The afternoons ain't the issue.....
Not sure a shell limit would help. If I only get 3 shots on a really good day, anything more than 12 shells is overkill. Besides, the bottom of the pond would be covered with discarded shotshells....
 
coachcornbread

coachcornbread

Ten Pointer
Clark said:
Used to hunt the ponds 3x week from dawn to dusk with great success. Now it is 2x a week until 1:00 with crappy hunting. The afternoons ain't the issue.....
Not sure a shell limit would help. If I only get 3 shots on a really good day, anything more than 12 shells is overkill. Besides, the bottom of the pond would be covered with discarded shotshells....
Click to expand...

So then whats the issue on the ponds you used to hunt then? If you used to hunt them with great success, then why has that success fallen off? Management? Hunter pressure? Lets hear it.
 
Clark

Clark

Ten Pointer
Not thrilled with my results:
Mattamuskeet - Not Selected - probably been 20+ years
Currituck Banks - Not Selected (got drawn last year but the water was too low to reach the blind)
Currituck NWR - Not Selected
Futch - Not Selected - been about 5 years
Falls of Neuse - Not Selected
Got Swan! Now if there were just some good public lands to hunt them... wait, I'll apply for some permits down East!
 
Last edited:
Clark

Clark

Ten Pointer
coachcornbread said:
So then what's the issue on the ponds you used to hunt then? If you used to hunt them with great success, then why has that success fallen off? Management? Hunter pressure? Lets hear it.
Click to expand...

Not a waterfowl biologist, and I know less than nothing about management, so no clue about the real causes. I do think the warm weather the last few decades has hurt.
The real problem for me is the permit restrictions - we used to choose to go when it was blowing, and cold too if possible. When we hunted 22/23 days out a 30 day season, we got several chances to hit it right, and usually got a few good hunts a year. Now, IF I'm lucky enough to get a permit for a single day in a season, I have no choice about the weather - it might be 70 degrees, calm and sunny (and has been a couple times).
Last 2 times we got a permit and good hunting weather, we had the pond to ourselves at 4:00, picked our favorite spot and got a couple shots at LST - then two guys in a canoe came in after legal and set up about 100 yards downwind - same spot both times, and we did not fire again. We were the only two parties in the pond both years, figure it had to be the same two guys each time. Guess you could call that 'pressure', we just call 'em a$$holes. I changed to my second choice pond this year so we will see if that helps.
 
coachcornbread

coachcornbread

Ten Pointer
Clark said:
Not a waterfowl biologist, and I know less than nothing about management, so no clue about the real causes. I do think the warm weather the last few decades has hurt.
The real problem for me is the permit restrictions - we used to choose to go when it was blowing, and cold too if possible. When we hunted 22/23 days out a 30 day season, we got several chances to hit it right, and usually got a few good hunts a year. Now, IF I'm lucky enough to get a permit for a single day in a season, I have no choice about the weather - it might be 70 degrees, calm and sunny (and has been a couple times).
Last 2 times we got a permit and good hunting weather, we had the pond to ourselves at 4:00, picked our favorite spot and got a couple shots at LST - then two guys in a canoe came in after legal and set up about 100 yards downwind - same spot both times, and we did not fire again. We were the only two parties in the pond both years, figure it had to be the same two guys each time. Guess you could call that 'pressure', we just call 'em a$$holes. I changed to my second choice pond this year so we will see if that helps.
Click to expand...

Just a wild guess here, but the "permit restrictions" were put in place due to people like the ones you mentioned. Take those away and the permit hunts will turn into more of a zoo than they already are.
 
Mr.Gadget

Mr.Gadget

Old Mossy Horns
If you dont get picked can you see why? Just to make sure it was not someone in the party that screwed things up not turning in swan info or not having correct HL in time?
 
shurshot

shurshot

Ten Pointer
coachcornbread said:
So then whats the issue on the ponds you used to hunt then? If you used to hunt them with great success, then why has that success fallen off? Management? Hunter pressure? Lets hear it.
Click to expand...

Mike, I’ll take a stab at it for better or for worse ....

First off, I’ve spent 46 years hunting hunting the state owned impoundments. I’ve had the luxury, like Clark, of hunting them 3x/wk. on a first come, first served basis and blistering their bottoms decades ago. I’d be willing to bet that Clark and I have even hunted beside each other or even struck up conversations (good or bad) with each other unbeknown to us. As time went on, a lot of changes happened and the hunting (duck use) steadily decreased. Had nothing to do imo with impoundment “mismanagement”, the SAV grasses (wigeon, musk grass, etc.) has always been in those ponds for the birds, rather we started seeing a huge influx of impoundments being built in Hyde which started holding/feeding more birds. We also saw the slow death of Eurasian milfoil in the Currituck sound, the very reason why birds wintered in that area. At one time it was estimated that it held over 25% of the AF wigeon population along with a great number of other birds. There also used to be huge beds of eel grass in the Pamlico River and Sound but they too died out. So with these habitat changes and periods of warm weather, birds started changing their usage areas. Where as it used to be I could run out in the sound and fill a bag with both divers and puddlers on a constant basis slowly became a issue of finding some divers just to shoot, let alone see a puddle duck. The birds in Hyde have pretty much abandoned the pot holes on the marshes in favor of 1000 plus corn impoundments. They also have a 43,000 acre refuge to sit on undisturbed. It all makes it hard on the public duck hunter over there.

Come back over to the Pamlico side and what we’ve seen here are close to 25 impoundments now on GCI which have impacted the state SAV waterfowl impoundments. I’d say 90% are planted in corn and they kill a lot of ducks. Then you have J. Johnson’s thousand acre “refuge” ponds which is why birds over in the area in the first place ..no pressure. Some do fly out to PP but you just don’t see many going to the other state impoundments. I think they do but think about all the hunters that are pressuring them from then wee hours of 2:00 am onward. Outboard motors screaming all over the place, spot lights lighting them up on the water, hunters crawling all over and around every impoundment and shining a 5 million power light in every direction possible. Draw hunters walking in and going the same-bumping ducks and swans that came in the evening before. Folks, it’s just way more people pressuring to fewer birds to the point they simply won’t stay around .....
I’ve got some ideas I think would improve the quality of the permit hunts but it probably won’t be popular with a lot of hunters.
 

Gus

Six Pointer
shurshot said:
Mike, I’ll take a stab at it for better or for worse ....

First off, I’ve spent 46 years hunting hunting the state owned impoundments. I’ve had the luxury, like Clark, of hunting them 3x/wk. on a first come, first served basis and blistering their bottoms decades ago. I’d be willing to bet that Clark and I have even hunted beside each other or even struck up conversations (good or bad) with each other unbeknown to us. As time went on, a lot of changes happened and the hunting (duck use) steadily decreased. Had nothing to do imo with impoundment “mismanagement”, the SAV grasses (wigeon, musk grass, etc.) has always been in those ponds for the birds, rather we started seeing a huge influx of impoundments being built in Hyde which started holding/feeding more birds. We also saw the slow death of Eurasian milfoil in the Currituck sound, the very reason why birds wintered in that area. At one time it was estimated that it held over 25% of the AF wigeon population along with a great number of other birds. There also used to be huge beds of eel grass in the Pamlico River and Sound but they too died out. So with these habitat changes and periods of warm weather, birds started changing their usage areas. Where as it used to be I could run out in the sound and fill a bag with both divers and puddlers on a constant basis slowly became a issue of finding some divers just to shoot, let alone see a puddle duck. The birds in Hyde have pretty much abandoned the pot holes on the marshes in favor of 1000 plus corn impoundments. They also have a 43,000 acre refuge to sit on undisturbed. It all makes it hard on the public duck hunter over there.

Come back over to the Pamlico side and what we’ve seen here are close to 25 impoundments now on GCI which have impacted the state SAV waterfowl impoundments. I’d say 90% are planted in corn and they kill a lot of ducks. Then you have J. Johnson’s thousand acre “refuge” ponds which is why birds over in the area in the first place ..no pressure. Some do fly out to PP but you just don’t see many going to the other state impoundments. I think they do but think about all the hunters that are pressuring them from then wee hours of 2:00 am onward. Outboard motors screaming all over the place, spot lights lighting them up on the water, hunters crawling all over and around every impoundment and shining a 5 million power light in every direction possible. Draw hunters walking in and going the same-bumping ducks and swans that came in the evening before. Folks, it’s just way more people pressuring to fewer birds to the point they simply won’t stay around .....
I’ve got some ideas I think would improve the quality of the permit hunts but it probably won’t be popular with a lot of hunters.
Click to expand...

Good post. Agree with all of that.
Nitpicking, but imo, wasn't much "slow" about the disappearance of milfoil in Currituck. Whether it was the salt water intrusion from the new canal into Back Bay, State or local govt spraying, or something else, in my areas it was mostly gone in two to three years. There were a few beds here and there but nothing like when you had to have a basket oer your prop or stop and clear it off every 5 mins. Damn shame.
 
coachcornbread

coachcornbread

Ten Pointer
shurshot said:
Mike, I’ll take a stab at it for better or for worse ....

First off, I’ve spent 46 years hunting hunting the state owned impoundments. I’ve had the luxury, like Clark, of hunting them 3x/wk. on a first come, first served basis and blistering their bottoms decades ago. I’d be willing to bet that Clark and I have even hunted beside each other or even struck up conversations (good or bad) with each other unbeknown to us. As time went on, a lot of changes happened and the hunting (duck use) steadily decreased. Had nothing to do imo with impoundment “mismanagement”, the SAV grasses (wigeon, musk grass, etc.) has always been in those ponds for the birds, rather we started seeing a huge influx of impoundments being built in Hyde which started holding/feeding more birds. We also saw the slow death of Eurasian milfoil in the Currituck sound, the very reason why birds wintered in that area. At one time it was estimated that it held over 25% of the AF wigeon population along with a great number of other birds. There also used to be huge beds of eel grass in the Pamlico River and Sound but they too died out. So with these habitat changes and periods of warm weather, birds started changing their usage areas. Where as it used to be I could run out in the sound and fill a bag with both divers and puddlers on a constant basis slowly became a issue of finding some divers just to shoot, let alone see a puddle duck. The birds in Hyde have pretty much abandoned the pot holes on the marshes in favor of 1000 plus corn impoundments. They also have a 43,000 acre refuge to sit on undisturbed. It all makes it hard on the public duck hunter over there.

Come back over to the Pamlico side and what we’ve seen here are close to 25 impoundments now on GCI which have impacted the state SAV waterfowl impoundments. I’d say 90% are planted in corn and they kill a lot of ducks. Then you have J. Johnson’s thousand acre “refuge” ponds which is why birds over in the area in the first place ..no pressure. Some do fly out to PP but you just don’t see many going to the other state impoundments. I think they do but think about all the hunters that are pressuring them from then wee hours of 2:00 am onward. Outboard motors screaming all over the place, spot lights lighting them up on the water, hunters crawling all over and around every impoundment and shining a 5 million power light in every direction possible. Draw hunters walking in and going the same-bumping ducks and swans that came in the evening before. Folks, it’s just way more people pressuring to fewer birds to the point they simply won’t stay around .....
I’ve got some ideas I think would improve the quality of the permit hunts but it probably won’t be popular with a lot of hunters.
Click to expand...

Very good assessment James. On the Pamlico County side my hunting has been limited to some hunts with friends over there that have private blinds and a handful of permit hunts on a state moist soil impoundment. When I first started going there you could have a pretty good shoot on widgeon, teal and swans. Over a 5 year span it got to the point where seeing a bird was a plus. I don’t even put in for it anymore.

99% of my hunting is open water in Hyde County, and the lack of grass is killing it by a slow death. When I first started going down there you could just about guarantee that you would shoot some bluebills, gadwall and some teal. Nowadays it’s just about a sea duck shoot, and even those are getting more rare.

All this goes back to my original statement of there’s nothing for birds to eat in the open water unless it’s poured out of a bag.
 

Dingbatter

Four Pointer
coachcornbread said:
I agree partially with your post, but I don’t think the issue is access to public land, it’s access to quality public land. There’s nowhere for birds to sit in sounds or lakes that has anything for them to eat unless it’s poured out of a bag. I fished damn near the entire shoreline of Pamlico and Hyde Counties this summer and can count on one hand the number of places I had to clean grass off my hooks. As far as public impoundments go, I wish they would go with a 12 pm cutoff time and limit people to 20 shells. That would solve a lot of the problems right there.
Click to expand...
I've been in support of a shell limit in public impoundments for years. Never got much support and a lot of flack from most. I always felt 25 shells were enough.
 

nekkedducker

Ten Pointer
My dad got drawn for a handicapped blind at an impoundment down east. If im interpreting the rules right, he is allowed one companion that must carry the companion card with them and can also hunt along side them in the blind. Am i interpreting this correctly, or is the companion only allowed to assist with transporting gear, setting decoys, retrieving birds, etc? I'm fine either way, Im just happy to spend some time with him and get him to experience hunting outside of harnett county for the first time.
 
coachcornbread

coachcornbread

Ten Pointer
nettereo16 said:
Same thing happened to me. 2 years in a row. I didn't think that's possible with the PP. Both years I applied by myself, was fully licensed, and did not fail to return a previous swan survey. Strange!
Click to expand...
Im interested to see how many total applicants there were. I dont think there was a reduction in total tags allowed, but I could be wrong.
 
Mr.Gadget

Mr.Gadget

Old Mossy Horns
coachcornbread said:
Im interested to see how many total applicants there were. I dont think there was a reduction in total tags allowed, but I could be wrong.
Click to expand...
We had points also but did not get picked.
Some of our guys said they changed the system. Making it easier for out of state and younger hunters to get them.
 
Clark

Clark

Ten Pointer
I read that half the swan tags are reserved for preference point holders and the remainder go to open draw. So if there are enough preference point people, may overwhelm the remaining available permits.
 
shurshot

shurshot

Ten Pointer
If I remember correctly, USFWS scaleded back on the permits. If not this year. for sure next year. Don’t think it was great amount but it was definitely on their radar.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top