Regarding Free College Tuition

[DBCooper]

Yes, but your equating free tuition to degree give aways....

Please don't resort to name calling.

No I’m not.

Please don’t resort to speaking for me. If you want to know what I mean - ask me.

 

[alt1001]

I actually didn't say that. I've only called for associate degrees.

You said: 'Public universities are not supposed to be giant money making machines.'

 

[Crappie_Hunter]

ECU, the reason people keep asking you about you age, job status etc. is you lack the perspective of most on here which (I think is fair to assume) is middle aged and senior men who are probably middle class folks who have raised, or are raising kids. They understand the hardships of providing for a family while being taxed way to much for programs and people that waste it.

I think it would be smart to listen to their experiences and wisdom as they have lived it. Things sound good on paper but it never works out that way, most of the guys on here have the life experience to prove it.

Couple old sayings: This world don't owe you a dime.... Fair is what comes around in September with cotton candy and rides.... and lastly, if you are not liberal when you are 20 you have no heart, if you are not a conservative when you're 40 you have no brain!

 

[bwfarms]

ECU, I want to know why you ignored a fair proposal. What do you object to about this?

How is this for a solution? If the government reduces each individual's tax burden $3000, there should be no excuse for anyone not to afford attending school for an associates degree. Those that choose to keep their $3000 and not go to school can invest or waste it as they see fit.

Why should people that choose to go to community college receive money and those that don't essentially are penalized?

 

[nontypical]

ECU, the reason people keep asking you about you age, job status etc. is you lack the perspective of most on here which (I think is fair to assume) is middle aged and senior men who are probably middle class folks who have raised, or are raising kids. They understand the hardships of providing for a family while being taxed way to much for programs and people that waste it.

I think it would be smart to listen to their experiences and wisdom as they have lived it. Things sound good on paper but it never works out that way, most of the guys on here have the life experience to prove it.

Couple old sayings: This world don't owe you a dime.... Fair is what comes around in September with cotton candy and rides.... and lastly, if you are not liberal when you are 20 you have no heart, if you are not a conservative when you're 40 you have no brain!

Great advice!

 

[sky hawk]

Sad part is your better off going to a county that pays a high supplement. A lot of times the poor counties with the most title 1 schools pay low supplements as well. You can make more money over that 5 years in a county with a good supplement than you can have forgiven off your loan by working title 1. Also don't have to deal with the headaches that ate normally associated with title 1 schools.

No. That's NOT the sad part. That's the beauty of it! It's part of supply and demand. Organizations offer loan repayment because their supply of professionals is too low, so they sweeten the deal. Same with the military. If a candidate chooses to not go that route, they may or may not be better off bearing the full load of their loans, but making a higher salary. Sometimes the quality of the candidate plays into the decision. That is the route my wife went. She had a military option at several points during her education, and she had a rural loan repayment option upon completion, but neither could compare to choosing a competitive position and paying the loans on our own.

It's called freedom. Freedom to choose different paths and control your own money. If the govt. demands more money from us to pay for others' free school, then our decision to pay back our loans independently is compromised by government control. More government control always stands opposed to personal freedom.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

Not without asking for something in return anyway. Workforce allocation and utilization could go a long way.

The return is more people working and paying taxes instead of being on government assistance. Its not just giving away money, its an investment.

You said: 'Public universities are not supposed to be giant money making machines.'

That was in reference to high tuition costs and 4 year universities. I said we should figure out ways to lower them, not make it free. That was a different topic being discussed.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

ECU, the reason people keep asking you about you age, job status etc. is you lack the perspective of most on here which (I think is fair to assume) is middle aged and senior men who are probably middle class folks who have raised, or are raising kids. They understand the hardships of providing for a family while being taxed way to much for programs and people that waste it.

I think it would be smart to listen to their experiences and wisdom as they have lived it. Things sound good on paper but it never works out that way, most of the guys on here have the life experience to prove it.

Couple old sayings: This world don't owe you a dime.... Fair is what comes around in September with cotton candy and rides.... and lastly, if you are not liberal when you are 20 you have no heart, if you are not a conservative when you're 40 you have no brain!

Like i said. Show me some objective information to prove your point. Not your subjective opinion from your limited life experience. Your basically saying that unless your over 40 with kids you cant be right.

 

[Crappie_Hunter]

Like i said. Show me some objective information to prove your point. Not your subjective opinion from your limited life experience. Your basically saying that unless your over 40 with kids you cant be right.

Look, I get it, you're a young kid, full of passion ready to solve the worlds problems. All I'm saying is once you actually live in the adult world for a while and see how things really are your perspectives will probably change.

 

[DBCooper]

Like i said. Show me some objective information to prove your point. Not your subjective opinion from your limited life experience. Your basically saying that unless your over 40 with kids you cant be right.

Here’s some free schooling for you.......

In discussions referencing education, you can bolster your arguments a little, simply by utilizing proper grammar.

 

[Greg]

I actually didn't say that. I've only called for associate degrees.

I haven't read all the way to the end yet ... but are you aware that NC has a "Middle College" program that allows NC High School students to attend community college while they are in HS and they finish their HS degrees while earning an Associate's Degree ... all on the taxpayer's dime??

So ... how are you going to make that "better"?

 

[DBCooper]

I haven't read all the way to the end yet ... but are you aware that NC has a "Middle College" program that allows NC High School students to attend community college while they are in HS and they finish their HS degrees while earning an Associate's Degree ... all on the taxpayer's dime??

So ... how are you going to make that "better"?

I’m imagining Joe Dirt’s face when Zander asked him why he didn’t just get a different wig.

 

[alt1001]

The return is more people working and paying taxes instead of being on government assistance. Its not just giving away money, its an investment.

Sorry, but that is a pipedream. There was a study that was released last year that estimated around half of all college graduates end up in a field not requiring a degree. A few years ago The Washington Post released a study that concluded only 27% of college graduates end up in a career related to their major.

So you're telling me that the public should foot the bill on something that they can't control the outcome? As evident in the above studies, 'more people working and paying taxes instead of being on government assistance' can be achieved without a college degree so why should taxpayer funding be used to fund them? If someone wants the freewill to choose a degree that will ultimately lead to their washout in said career, then the public shouldn't be asked to pay for it. If someone wants to choose a degree that the government has identified as in high demand (i.e. doctors, teachers, engineers, etc) and they would like for taxpayer funds be used to pay for their education in exchange for choosing said fields, those programs already exist.

 

[wcjones]

Sad part is your better off going to a county that pays a high supplement. A lot of times the poor counties with the most title 1 schools pay low supplements as well. You can make more money over that 5 years in a county with a good supplement than you can have forgiven off your loan by working title 1. Also don't have to deal with the headaches that ate normally associated with title 1 schools.

But you have a higher COL. So are you truly better off? You have to consider all factors not just the zeros on your paycheck.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

ECU, I want to know why you ignored a fair proposal. What do you object to about this?

If your already so poor your on government welfare that 3000 is probably going to get used pretty quickly on other issues. No guarantee it goes toward education. Also im not proposing everyone gets an associate. My solution addresses people who want an education yours goes to everyone. Apples and oranges.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

Look, I get it, you're a young kid, full of passion ready to solve the worlds problems. All I'm saying is once you actually live in the adult world for a while and see how things really are your perspectives will probably change.

Again, hit me with some facts. Dont explain away a valid argument by using my age. I have proof that it worked in another state. These are not fantasies im making up. Your literally ignoring reality.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

Here’s some free schooling for you.......

In discussions referencing education, you can bolster your arguments a little, simply by utilizing proper grammar.

Your really scraping the bottom of the barrel now. First name calling, now grammar checking. You sir are a master debater.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

I haven't read all the way to the end yet ... but are you aware that NC has a "Middle College" program that allows NC High School students to attend community college while they are in HS and they finish their HS degrees while earning an Associate's Degree ... all on the taxpayer's dime??

So ... how are you going to make that "better"?

Does NC have it or is provided by certain counties. Im aware of the program just not sure who provides it.

I also think many of these programs you have to be accepted into and they only take a certain amount. So its not the same.

 

[MJ74]

If your already so poor your on government welfare that 3000 is probably going to get used pretty quickly on other issues. No guarantee it goes toward education. Also im not proposing everyone gets an associate. My solution addresses people who want an education yours goes to everyone. Apples and oranges.

That's one of the problems around here anyway....alot of the people here on welfare aren't poor, they are just sorry and/or lazy.
Welfare is a lifestyle to them and they believe they are entitled to it. Alot of them don't even understand where the money comes from that pays welfare.

These are the same people who know how to work every crack in the system.

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk

 

[ECU_Pirate]

But you have a higher COL. So are you truly better off? You have to consider all factors not just the zeros on your paycheck.

Yes, your better off. I know plenty of teachers who did what i talked about for the reasons i stated.

 

[Crappie_Hunter]

Again, hit me with some facts. Dont explain away a valid argument by using my age. I have proof that it worked in another state. These are not fantasies im making up. Your literally ignoring reality.

A valid argument for what exactly? That society is better off if poor people are given an associates degree?

 

[ECU_Pirate]

Sorry, but that is a pipedream. There was a study that was released last year that estimated around half of all college graduates end up in a field not requiring a degree. A few years ago The Washington Post released a study that concluded only 27% of college graduates end up in a career related to their major.

So you're telling me that the public should foot the bill on something that they can't control the outcome? As evident in the above studies, 'more people working and paying taxes instead of being on government assistance' can be achieved without a college degree so why should taxpayer funding be used to fund them? If someone wants the freewill to choose a degree that will ultimately lead to their washout in said career, then the public shouldn't be asked to pay for it. If someone wants to choose a degree that the government has identified as in high demand (i.e. doctors, teachers, engineers, etc) and they would like for taxpayer funds be used to pay for their education in exchange for choosing said fields, those programs already exist.

Nine out of 10 new jobs are going to those with a college degree

Nine of out ten new jobs created in the last year have gone to those with a college degree, a finding showing the American economy’s growing reliance on a...

www.marketwatch.com

 

[ECU_Pirate]

That society is better off if poor people are given an associates degree?

Do yall just repeat lies until they become true?? How many times do i have to say that no one is being given a degree.

NO

ONE

IS

BEING

GIVEN

A

DEGREE

 

[DBCooper]

Your really scraping the bottom of the barrel now. First name calling, now grammar checking. You sir are a master debater.

No. I just take offense when people put words in my mouth in an attempt to bolster their argument.

You never have to assume I mean anything. I mean exactly what I write. If you’re unclear - ask. If you attempt to speak for me, “idiot” is kind.

 

[nontypical]

Felicity Huffman and Lori Loughlin Charged With Mail Fraud in Massive College Exam Scheme

Felicity Huffman and Lori Loughlin were among the 40 people charged with possible mail fraud in a massive college entrance exam scheme. An arrest warrant for the pair — and dozens of others — was issued on March 11 in Boston, Massachusetts for conspiracy to commit mail fraud and honest services...

www.yahoo.com

Or you can just do like these people did to make sure your kids get in the very best institution

 

[bwfarms]

Do yall just repeat lies until they become true?? How many times do i have to say that no one is being given a degree.

NO

ONE

IS

BEING

GIVEN

A

DEGREE

But you think it's going to be free.

If your already so poor your on government welfare that 3000 is probably going to get used pretty quickly on other issues. No guarantee it goes toward education. Also im not proposing everyone gets an associate. My solution addresses people who want an education yours goes to everyone. Apples and oranges.

And why wouldn't you want everybody to be treated fairly? Wait it doesn't align with your mission. You only want a select few in poverty to improve their situation. Ah I can see it clearly now, you don't really want to help everyone.

 

[Crappie_Hunter]

Well, if they don't complete the program does the state get their money back (good luck, they are already on government assistance)? What if it takes them 5 years? What if they get their degree, then sit on their ass the rest of their life? Is their work requirements once you complete the degree? What if since every Tom, Dick, and Harry now has an associates degree the marketplace deems them worthless?

Free rides aren't the answer, you want something bad enough you will go get it. THEN society will be better off.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

No. I just take offense when people put words in my mouth in an attempt to bolster their argument.

You never have to assume I mean anything. I mean exactly what I write. If you’re unclear - ask. If you attempt to speak for me, “idiot” is kind.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

But you think it's going to be free.



And why wouldn't you want everybody to be treated fairly? Wait it doesn't align with your mission. You only want a select few in poverty to improve their situation. Ah I can see it clearly now, you don't really want to help everyone.

I have explained that free tuition does not equal being handed a degree. I cant understand it for you.

I just didnt think it was a better way to accomplish what my idea is trying to accomplish. If you like that idea thats fine, i didnt. If you dont think more people being educated and working helps us all i dont know what to tell you.

 

[ECU_Pirate]

Well, if they don't complete the program does the state get their money back (good luck, they are already on government assistance)? What if it takes them 5 years? What if they get their degree, then sit on their ass the rest of their life? Is their work requirements once you complete the degree? What if since every Tom, Dick, and Harry now has an associates degree the marketplace deems them worthless?

Free rides aren't the answer, you want something bad enough you will go get it. THEN society will be better off.

Those are all valid concerns. I think the positives would make up for any losses you mentioned. Wanting and affording an education are two different things.